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 What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?

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Liche
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PostSubject: Re: What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?   Tue Dec 02, 2008 6:27 am

Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:

Your post doesn't imply that in any way. And, if they do think so, then they're absolutely wrong.
Oh my god!

You can see the future?!
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Zealot_Kommunizma
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PostSubject: Re: What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?   Tue Dec 02, 2008 7:06 am

Liche wrote:

Oh my god!

You can see the future?!

As in like I can forsee that a functional habitational skyscrapper cannot be built out of shit? Or like foreseeing that turning over a glass of water will make the floor wet? In that case, yes I can.

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Liche
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PostSubject: Re: What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?   Tue Dec 02, 2008 7:26 am

Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:
Liche wrote:

Oh my god!

You can see the future?!

As in like I can forsee that a functional habitational skyscrapper cannot be built out of shit? Or like foreseeing that turning over a glass of water will make the floor wet? In that case, yes I can.
well, sorry this situation is a 'little' bit different. for all you know Obama could hand over power to a revolutionary group. its unlikely, but positive.
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Zealot_Kommunizma
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PostSubject: Re: What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?   Tue Dec 02, 2008 8:13 am

Liche wrote:


well, sorry this situation is a 'little' bit different. for all you know Obama could hand over power to a revolutionary group. its unlikely, but positive.

Yeah, because after all it's not just the easiest thing. It would also automatically change the entire way in which USA's economy is run without the slightest violence.

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Liche
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PostSubject: Re: What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?   Tue Dec 02, 2008 4:01 pm

well you said Obama is not gonna help the economy. Just because the economy is not the way you like, doesn't mean its not good. As long as it gets on track, people will credit him with helping the economy.

most peoples idea of a 'good economy' are different than yours.
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Black_Cross
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PostSubject: Re: What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?   Tue Dec 02, 2008 8:41 pm

Liche wrote:
well you said Obama is not gonna help the economy. Just because the economy is not the way you like, doesn't mean its not good. As long as it gets on track, people will credit him with helping the economy.

most peoples idea of a 'good economy' are different than yours.

Mostly cos they're fooled (maybe they fool themselves) thinking that when the stock market is up, they are actually living better. The economy only affects us working folk during recessions, really. We foot the bill when the going gets rough, and they take the profits when everything's all "better".

And as for Obama, the best we can hope for is some superficial changes. Even if his intentions are pure, he'll find it very hard to overcome the pressure from the ruling class, which we'll keep doing business as it always has.

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Zealot_Kommunizma
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PostSubject: Re: What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?   Tue Dec 02, 2008 10:35 pm

Liche wrote:
well you said Obama is not gonna help the economy. Just because the economy is not the way you like, doesn't mean its not good. As long as it gets on track, people will credit him with helping the economy.

most peoples idea of a 'good economy' are different than yours.

You see why you shouldn't reply to what yo don't read?

I never said he's not going to help the capitalist economy. I said that in no way he's going to aid in the struggle for communism. I was attacking CPUSA's endorsement of Obama and pointing out that as evidence of their lack of communisticity. If Obama helps the capitalist economy, which probably he will do through Keynesianism, he's actually hindering the path towards communism.

If they were really communist they wouldn't endorse either of the candidates and would instead be doing something to raise teh working class's awareness.

That was my point, I wasn't adressing Obama's capability to help the capitalist economy but CPUSA's communisticity.

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PostSubject: Re: What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?   Wed Dec 03, 2008 12:43 am

Black_Cross wrote:

Mostly cos they're fooled (maybe they fool themselves) thinking that when the stock market is up, they are actually living better. The economy only affects us working folk during recessions, really. We foot the bill when the going gets rough, and they take the profits when everything's all "better".

All of my life and most of my friend's lives have just exactly been what you have said here, Black Cross. Nothing ever gets better for the normal people, no matter WHAT country you live in now, and they are all completed fooled by the collective material "wealth" their country has. They always complain and hate about the government having to control them like in Stalinism. Well, what has US capitalist governments doing for the past 500 years? I just don't understand having to literally pay in disposable paper just to have a home and food. People can be so blind... Sad

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Liche
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PostSubject: Re: What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?   Thu Dec 04, 2008 3:52 am

Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:
Liche wrote:
well you said Obama is not gonna help the economy. Just because the economy is not the way you like, doesn't mean its not good. As long as it gets on track, people will credit him with helping the economy.

most peoples idea of a 'good economy' are different than yours.

You see why you shouldn't reply to what yo don't read?

I never said he's not going to help the capitalist economy. I said that in no way he's going to aid in the struggle for communism. I was attacking CPUSA's endorsement of Obama and pointing out that as evidence of their lack of communisticity. If Obama helps the capitalist economy, which probably he will do through Keynesianism, he's actually hindering the path towards communism.

If they were really communist they wouldn't endorse either of the candidates and would instead be doing something to raise teh working class's awareness.

That was my point, I wasn't adressing Obama's capability to help the capitalist economy but CPUSA's communisticity.
well correct me if I'm wrong but I believe I said "Maybe they think he will help the (US) econom?" and you said "well they are wrong"
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Zealot_Kommunizma
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PostSubject: Re: What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?   Thu Dec 04, 2008 10:05 am

Liche wrote:

well correct me if I'm wrong but I believe I said "Maybe they think he will help the (US) econom?" and you said "well they are wrong"

Yes, you're wrong. This is how the discussion goes:

Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:
Liche wrote:
I am saying that they endorsed Obama because he would make it easier for the transition towards Communism by helping to structure the economy.


Your post doesn't imply that in any way. And, if they do think so, then they're absolutely wrong.


What I mean with that is that they're wrong if they think that imposing a Keynesianist economic structure (In case Obama indeed does so) is going to assist in the construction of communism.

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Liche
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PostSubject: Re: What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?   Thu Dec 04, 2008 1:21 pm

well, I believe it would help.
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Zealot_Kommunizma
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PostSubject: Re: What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?   Thu Dec 04, 2008 8:48 pm

Liche wrote:
well, I believe it would help.

You believe it would help the economy.

But, objectively is in no way a step closer to Communism.

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Stos
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PostSubject: Re: What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?   Fri Dec 05, 2008 3:00 pm

Liche wrote:
well, I believe it would help.
It would make things more equal (though there would still be exploitation and such). For a while.
Then it would collapse in a stagflation crisis, and we'd go back to neoliberalism, in a repeat of the so-called 'Reagan Revolution', which really started with experimentation in Chile, and then with bankers and such under the Carter administration.
That's assuming that Obama's bosses even have any reason to go back to Keynesianism. This crisis is a 'safe crisis', that is, there's no revolutionary movement to appease, they can just go on with their neoliberal crap supported by the terribly cliched 'freedom' and 'democracy' rhetoric. Richard Nixon once said, "We are all Keynesians now". Bill Clinton could have said, and Obama could still say, "We are all neoliberals now."
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PostSubject: Re: What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?   Fri Dec 05, 2008 5:19 pm

what?
stos are you mentally retarded?
do you even know what neoliberalism is?
it's the god of capitalism and explotation and you can't talk about it.
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PostSubject: Re: What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?   Fri Dec 05, 2008 8:15 pm

mattabesta wrote:
what?
stos are you mentally retarded?
do you even know what neoliberalism is?
it's the god of capitalism and explotation and you can't talk about it.
That's nice.
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PostSubject: Re: What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?   Sat Dec 27, 2008 12:44 am

Liche wrote:
Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:
Kenzu wrote:
I havent seen anything bad that CPUSA has ever made. I thik they are going the right way to strengthen communism in capitalist fortress USA.

By endorsing Obama? O_o

US = Two Party System

CPUSA = Third Party

Third Party = No win

they figured Obama would help the country, keep in mind they are also Americans.
its called being symbolic, I dought obama got more votes because of the CPUSA
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PostSubject: Re: What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?   Sat Dec 27, 2008 12:53 am

cary jebus wrote:

its called being symbolic, I dought obama got more votes because of the CPUSA

It's an utterely unnecesary symbolism.

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PostSubject: Re: What is Socialism? What is the difference between Communism?   Sun Dec 28, 2008 1:47 pm

cary jebus wrote:
Liche wrote:
Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:
Kenzu wrote:
I havent seen anything bad that CPUSA has ever made. I thik they are going the right way to strengthen communism in capitalist fortress USA.

By endorsing Obama? O_o

US = Two Party System

CPUSA = Third Party

Third Party = No win

they figured Obama would help the country, keep in mind they are also Americans.
its called being symbolic, I dought obama got more votes because of the CPUSA
Probably did, apparently CPUSA members were wearing the HOPE and CHANGE and OBAMA '08 badges.
As for Obama helping the country, that's just being stupid. Anyways, they're currently a joke, and a shell of their former Stalinist self, where they at least provided amusement by switching positions every time Moscow did.
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