Tibetan Independence

I would like to hear your thoughts about Tibet and whether it should be independent.

Personally, I don't think it should.

My reasons:

1. Tibet's 'legitimacy' is totally fake. China has had Tibet for almost a milennia years, the only reason it turned 'independent' was because the British took it in 1903 as a colony and then freed it. Plus, the British treated them like slaves.

2. Dalai Lama's puppet regime, prior to 1951 when China regained Tibet, Tibet was still a slavery society. Of course Dalai Lama would want his government back in place.

3. China supplies at least 200 million yuan, or 40 million USD improving Tibet's education, infrastructure, etc.

4. The CIA has had a presence in Tibet and has funded Dalai Lama, funding which is still going to this day, to force China to let go of Tibet, most likely for political reasons. Plus, the CIA and British forced India to house Dalai Lama's government in the 1950s.

5. Tibetan protests are violent, at least 100 people are dead already. These protests basically provoke the authorities to fire, the riots have burned buildings, thrown stones, and caused much more damage, and this is not limited to China. One NYPD officer was injured by a protest near the Chinese Consultate in New York just recently.

6. There is a bitter irony, people talk of repression of Tibet's people, but remain silent on how harsh Native Americans, Aboriginies, and the like have been treated.

There is a difference between revolution in an area that was truly oppressed and actually had rights (Colonists in America were protesting over rights, which were outlined in Magna Carta and numerous other documents) and a minority who are using violent protests against bystanders and are trying to seperate a large portion of a country which has been part of a nation for centuries for purely political reasons under the guise of repression.

[Free Tibet]

carmen510 wrote:

I would like to hear your thoughts about Tibet and whether it should be independent.

Personally, I don't think it should.

My reasons:

1. Tibet's 'legitimacy' is totally fake. China has had Tibet for almost a milennia years, the only reason it turned 'independent' was because the British took it in 1903 as a colony and then freed it. Plus, the British treated them like slaves.

2. Dalai Lama's puppet regime, prior to 1951 when China regained Tibet, Tibet was still a slavery society. Of course Dalai Lama would want his government back in place.

3. China supplies at least 200 million yuan, or 40 million USD improving Tibet's education, infrastructure, etc.

4. The CIA has had a presence in Tibet and has funded Dalai Lama, funding which is still going to this day, to force China to let go of Tibet, most likely for political reasons. Plus, the CIA and British forced India to house Dalai Lama's government in the 1950s.

5. Tibetan protests are violent, at least 100 people are dead already. These protests basically provoke the authorities to fire, the riots have burned buildings, thrown stones, and caused much more damage, and this is not limited to China. One NYPD officer was injured by a protest near the Chinese Consultate in New York just recently.

6. There is a bitter irony, people talk of repression of Tibet's people, but remain silent on how harsh Native Americans, Aboriginies, and the like have been treated.

There is a difference between revolution in an area that was truly oppressed and actually had rights (Colonists in America were protesting over rights, which were outlined in Magna Carta and numerous other documents) and a minority who are using violent protests against bystanders and are trying to seperate a large portion of a country which has been part of a nation for centuries for purely political reasons under the guise of repression.

all so true.

tibet can't be a country on it's own but china never ruled it till the qin

I definately agree with this "Tibet" issue. It's a total sham against China, especially with the largest protest just recently. And the US and EU blame China for "degrading human rights" and using "unnessecary force" against the protesters, when in reality, most of the dead are Han Chinese and foreign vistors themselves.

It seems people never seem to care about the victims of American aggression, especially the Native Americans. That and America really hasn't apologized either.

And yeah, it seems the CIA funds everything nowadays. lawls

The Dali Lama was a feudalist tyrant and Tibet is better off under Chinese rule.

oligarch wrote:

The Dali Lama was a feudalist tyrant and Tibet is better off under Chinese rule.

The Chinese maoists/state-capitalists haven't done much good at all for Tibet. But I suppose a lot of things beat feudalism...

Chinese system is 100 times better than the slavery that was in Tibet while it was on its own.

Demonstrants who lynch innocent people with stones belong to jail!
Why do people in the west get angry, when the police arrests such criminals?

I think it's because they see Chinese police as "cruel and inhumane" AKA torture.

Of course Chinese police use torture to extract information, every organization uses inhumane methods at one point.

In fact, torture has been a rather regular part in Chinese culture. It supposedly teaches the violator a lesson not to do it again. Well, granted, torture hurts a lot and would seriously imprint something in a person's mind forever.

But if it wasn't for the Western "mentality" of "freedom of everything" (what BS) invading the world's people's, Tibet wouldn't have this "protest" problem, China wouldn't be so harsh, and everybody would just get along.

Western's and Eastern's concept of "freedom" just doesn't mix and if I remember correctly, the West used to be WORSE than the East at one point.

Something like THIS:

Jeiro Sijakeuigwan wrote:

I think it's because they see Chinese police as "cruel and inhumane" AKA torture.

Of course Chinese police use torture to extract information, every organization uses inhumane methods at one point.

In fact, torture has been a rather regular part in Chinese culture. It supposedly teaches the violator a lesson not to do it again. Well, granted, torture hurts a lot and would seriously imprint something in a person's mind forever.

But if it wasn't for the Western "mentality" of "freedom of everything" (what BS) invading the world's people's, Tibet wouldn't have this "protest" problem, China wouldn't be so harsh, and everybody would just get along.

Western's and Eastern's concept of "freedom" just doesn't mix and if I remember correctly, the West used to be WORSE than the East at one point.

Something like THIS:

you know china did burn down buddist tempels and you are a weri disdurbed person if you think torture is good

I'm not saying torture is good. I am merely saying that torture was and still is a part of Chinese culture. Most, if not all, Asian cultures used torture regularly in wars and as punishment.

China burning down Tibetian Buddhist temples? Hmm...they might have done that when they claimed back Tibet in 1959 but today, I seriously believe that is merely Western propaganda to instigate China even more than the amount of huge problems they face back home.

Tibet is a minor issue really.

Jeiro Sijakeuigwan wrote:

China burning down Tibetian Buddhist temples? Hmm...they might have done that when they claimed back Tibet in 1959 but today, I seriously believe that is merely Western propaganda to instigate China even more than the amount of huge problems they face back home.

No that happened during the Cultural Revolution as well.

oligarch wrote:

Jeiro Sijakeuigwan wrote:

China burning down Tibetian Buddhist temples? Hmm...they might have done that when they claimed back Tibet in 1959 but today, I seriously believe that is merely Western propaganda to instigate China even more than the amount of huge problems they face back home.

No that happened during the Cultural Revolution as well.

I guess Jeiro's point is that it just doesn't happen anymore.

Anyway, I agree that Tibet shouldn't be independent. Remember that guy that set himself on fire as a protest against the "occupation" of Tibet? I guess China wants more guys like him.

Jeiro Sijakeuigwan wrote:

I'm not saying torture is good. I am merely saying that torture was and still is a part of Chinese culture. Most, if not all, Asian cultures used torture regularly in wars and as punishment.

China burning down Tibetian Buddhist temples? Hmm...they might have done that when they claimed back Tibet in 1959 but today, I seriously believe that is merely Western propaganda to instigate China even more than the amount of huge problems they face back home.

Tibet is a minor issue really.

oh your just respecting chinas cultur got ya

Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:

I guess Jeiro's point is that it just doesn't happen anymore.

Anyway, I agree that Tibet shouldn't be independent. Remember that guy that set himself on fire as a protest against the "occupation" of Tibet? I guess China wants more guys like him.

It really doesn't happen any more, but the Tibetians are getting dangerous to China. China already has a LOAD of problems on it's own and the "free" Tibet thing isn't helping any. It's only getting China more and more angry.

If China's government were to snap and unleash hell, it would not only look bad on the world, but make the normal Chinese hate their government more than already is.

If those blinded protesters would just shut up and not instigate China even more, I bet you the Chinese government would actually respect them. Hell, perhaps even give more "autonomy" to them.

Besides, it's NOT like what Japan tried to do to Korea in the 1910-1945s...

Jeiro Sijakeuigwan wrote:

Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:

I guess Jeiro's point is that it just doesn't happen anymore.

Anyway, I agree that Tibet shouldn't be independent. Remember that guy that set himself on fire as a protest against the "occupation" of Tibet? I guess China wants more guys like him.

It really doesn't happen any more, but the Tibetians are getting dangerous to China. China already has a LOAD of problems on it's own and the "free" Tibet thing isn't helping any. It's only getting China more and more angry.

If China's government were to snap and unleash hell, it would not only look bad on the world, but make the normal Chinese hate their government more than already is.

If those blinded protesters would just shut up and not instigate China even more, I bet you the Chinese government would actually respect them. Hell, perhaps even give more "autonomy" to them.

Besides, it's NOT like what Japan tried to do to Korea in the 1910-1945s...

you mean occupy and destroy?

Tibet is an "autonomous" region. Meaning, it has it's own government under check by Chinese government. Meaning it is independent. Somewhat. XD

And China pumps over 40 million $$$ into the Tibet region. Fancy that.

Jeiro Sijakeuigwan wrote:

It really doesn't happen any more, but the Tibetians are getting dangerous to China. China already has a LOAD of problems on it's own and the "free" Tibet thing isn't helping any. It's only getting China more and more angry.

Well, it's understandable that Chinese government is getting more and more angry, but, at the same time, as long as these guys are not rebellious enough China can just ignore them with a little bit of hostility.

Jeiro Sijakeuigwan wrote:

If China's government were to snap and unleash hell, it would not only look bad on the world, but make the normal Chinese hate their government more than already is.

I don't think they hate their government that much... but Indeed I think it's better for the Chinese government to treat the Tibetian issue carefuly.

Jeiro Sijakeuigwan wrote:

If those blinded protesters would just shut up and not instigate China even more, I bet you the Chinese government would actually respect them. Hell, perhaps even give more "autonomy" to them.

Well they want Independence from China so that they can become one more of the autonomous invisible stars in the red Spangled Banner.

Jeiro Sijakeuigwan wrote:

Besides, it's NOT like what Japan tried to do to Korea in the 1910-1945s...

Indeed, not even comparable.

Glad you agree with me.

And yes, China's government has to be very careful. Because the UN (coughUSbackedcough) will impose harsh sactions. X3

Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:

Jeiro Sijakeuigwan wrote:

If China's government were to snap and unleash hell, it would not only look bad on the world, but make the normal Chinese hate their government more than already is.

I don't think they hate their government that much... but Indeed I think it's better for the Chinese government to treat the Tibetian issue carefuly.

I hear the spirit in China is actually very democratic.

Nice to see some good discussion here.

I wonder what would happen if China caved into demands for Free Tibet, and just took out all the money in the system, as well as give Western companies a rude kick in their factories.

carmen510 wrote:

Nice to see some good discussion here.

Indeed

carmen510 wrote:

I wonder what would happen if China caved into demands for Free Tibet, and just took out all the money in the system, as well as give Western companies a rude kick in their factories.

I think Tibet would just become some puppet for West. And I think that China will never kick its greatest revenue source

carmen510 wrote:

Nice to see some good discussion here.

I wonder what would happen if China caved into demands for Free Tibet, and just took out all the money in the system, as well as give Western companies a rude kick in their factories.

tibet independent? noting would happen it would just go poor and economic growth would vanish

Free Tibet, look at Israel they are doing alright and they were based on that Jews needed a country to call there own, and since im a Buddhist my self then of course i think that Buddhists should have a country to call our own. and when Tibet is fried it would be Dalai Lama who is gonna be in power

Ryom wrote:

Free Tibet, look at Israel they are doing alright and they were based on that Jews needed a country to call there own, and since im a Buddhist my self then of course i think that Buddhists should have a country to call our own. and when Tibet is fried it would be Dalai Lama who is gonna be in power

Israel perpetuates its existence through constant warfare and oppression and the Dalai Lama was a totalitarian dictator.

Ryom wrote:

Free Tibet, look at Israel they are doing alright and they were based on that Jews needed a country to call there own, and since im a Buddhist my self then of course i think that Buddhists should have a country to call our own. and when Tibet is fried it would be Dalai Lama who is gonna be in power

Buddhism is not a nationalist religion, contrary to Judaism. The creation of Tibet was just an excuse for the Dalai Lama to get even political power.