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 Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security

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alexCCCP-RUS-54321
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 3:49 am

Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:
alexCCCP-RUS-54321 wrote:

WHy is ID Bullshit?

Because of how highly fragile, inefficient and suceptible organisms are.

Wisdom teeth, how do they evidence intelligent design? Cancer?

Alex wrote:

Explain? It takes intelligence to create intelligence.

Based on what arguement is intelligence needed to create intelligence? A statement won't do.



Alex wrote:

Is your brain itelligent?

I wonder if this is even properly asked....

Alex wrote:

Also, science has proved that animals have "evolved" but has not proved they have evolved the way Darwin says they have.

Which would be relevant because?

Alex wrote:

Humans have "evolved". But can you prove they have evlolved for the reason Darwin said they would?

I'll have to ask, according to you what's the "way Darwin said they would"?

And, why is Darwin relevant? The important thing here is evolution and the origin of species, not Charlie.

Alex wrote:

WAS there a reason to evolve

For the organism to survive?

Alex wrote:

(speaking scietifically? Humans, we think, eveolved from guerrillas.

I think I can trace back my origins to Spartacist rebels and perhaps the M-26-7.


Alex wrote:

Which is teh higher life form? To achieve that lifeform, you would need extra information, actually lots of information, added to the existing DNA. ( I could ellaborate more, but I'll leave you that)

I don't know if anyone agrees with me but I think this parragrpah was somewhat unintelligible.




Alex wrote:
And you guys haven't yet answred my first post, about the oscilliting universe thing.

Tyrong replied you like... what? 3-4 times?

Alex wrote:

Calling the data incomplete, is sort of ignorant. It seems that the universe is ever-expanding.

Seems, not known for certain and whether this was true or not how is that relevant to the existance of god?

Alex wrote:

If so, does that mean teh oscilliting universe theory doesn't work?

Nothing proven yet so no assertions can be accurate enough, including of course, the oscillating universe.

Alex wrote:

And Zealot_Kommuniza, don't say that my posts were ignorant, cuz, I couldn't be bothered that much if they were.

What? When did I say "your posts were ignorant"?

Alex wrote:

I just want to see if you acknowledge taht all recent data shows that the universe is ever-expanding.

Which tells me absolutely nothing. The only ridiculous position ion regards to this topic could be of complete certainty.
God is responsibe for good, Satan for bad. God Fights Satan. As simple as that. I hope you understand what I mean. I'm kinda in a bit of a rush.

How can you create intelligence without having intlligence to realize what intelligence is? And to create intelligence, without having intelligence? It taeks time to evelove. If there is a threat to survival serious enough to trigger adaptation, you think the organism would have enugh time to evolve, to meet it?

Do we know for sure how species evolved, why?

The crossing of chromosones or something like that...But how would teh orgnaisms know how to evlove? What would trigger their DNA to change, and in what way? Let's say you had two legs. Then your DNA "evolved" and soyou grow a tail. Would you need more DNA to get an extra tail? Yes you would, and where would that come from?

Well mayeb he did, but anwer this question. With the universe as we know it, teh universe is ever expanding. All recent data points to the universe being ever expanding? Do you deny the universe being ever expanding? Back up your claim, please? Im trying to prove the possibility of God as a serious option. But maybe proving the oscilliting universe theory wrong, it would be onse step...

Is teh universe is ever-expanding, then the iscilliting universe theory is no more. I'm trying to show that. By acknowledging that the universe is ever expanding, it means the teh oscilliting universe theory is not right. That's what it tells you.
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 3:56 am

To Alex about the Cross---

You do realize how hypocritical it is too worship a cross? Jesus was killed on the cross. The only reason to ware a cross is to say you have no shame. The cross was a sign of criminals back then, hence, criminals got crucified. Cross's are worn too show your faith and forgiveness in others, not to be worshiped.

The Knights Templar Spat at the cross.
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alexCCCP-RUS-54321
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 3:58 am

Liche wrote:
To Alex about the Cross---

You do realize how hypocritical it is too worship a cross? Jesus was killed on the cross. The only reason to ware a cross is to say you have no shame. The cross was a sign of criminals back then, hence, criminals got crucified. Cross's are worn too show your faith and forgiveness in others, not to be worshiped.

The Knights Templar Spat at the cross.
That's why priests wear crosses, right? It represents Jesus' sacrifice. (Not only taht, however)
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 4:07 am

Alex wrote:
He created the laws of the universe and he can not over power himself, becasue its equeal energy.

This, Alex, doesn't make sense. So he opposes himself? You he exists and doesn't exist? So he's a contradiction?

Alex wrote:

For example, he created the law that energy can not be created or destroyed, but only transformed.

But he created matter so he nulified his own law.

Alex wrote:

Therefore, he can not make food appear for the poor, because he can not overpower himself.

Aha... so he cannot help because he has forbidden himself to help. But he helps right?

Alex wrote:

God lives outside the realm of time and space, and so he is not governed by his rules, but we are.

So he's not governed by his rules but... wait seemingly according to you he is:
Alex wrote:
He created the laws of the universe and he can not over power himself, becasue its equeal energy.

See? So not and yes, but yes and no. In the end (and begining) none and all.



Alex wrote:

He could create teh universe, but we can't and with the universe we live in, energy can not be created, and so God can not transfer his energy here, because he cannot overpower himself.

Yeah because he's not governed by his laws right? So he can violate them and transport some 1,000 million T-bones to the starvelings around the world.

Alex wrote:

Hey, don't forget about Satan.

I had sex with him yesterday, how could I forget him/her/it? It' was a two-individuals orgy!

Wait... are you implying Satan is god's self-prohibition?

Alex wrote:

I already explained why he cannot help the people in Africa to an extent that great.

Yup, through an oxymoron. So he's omnipotently powerless.

Alex wrote:

And I just realized, by creating a stone he cannot lift, he is still allpowerfull, becasue he has created a stone with infinite weight, which takes infinite energy. By doing so, he is allpowerfull. HE cannot overpower himslef, because he still wins. By creating a stone he cannot lift, he proves he ahs enough energy to do so.

So gof creates a god that creates a god to create a god....

Even so... did you know that so far no stone within Earth is of infinite weight? I'm sure god could lift it.


Alex wrote:

The greatest evil is the one that doesn't die.

Why did Lord almighty let those evils be born in the first place?

Why would he create evil he cannot overpower?

Alex wrote:

Cancer cells don't die, but must be cut out, in one form or another. He can't change our lives in some ways, because of teh lawws he created that don't let him do so.

Aha. Because he's not governed by the laws that govern us but he is... nonetheless he can help.


Alex wrote:

How to kill the leader of a bad organization, for example.

What the hell???

Alex wrote:

He cannot create a force of energy strong enough taht can overpower his own law of enegy not being able to be created in this universe, to kill this man, [u]because taht would mean create something from nothing in this universe.[/b]

Which is, according to yourself what he did in the first place by creating all?

Alex wrote:

He cannot create energy, and break his law, because that would mean having more energy than he has.

But he did create everything so he did break it. Or are you talking about a Deist god that condemned himself to eternal repentment for creating factors that make us suffer that he can't overcome but yet see?

Ah, but he helps!

Alex wrote:

By having more energy, teh law is stronger, and so equeally is his energy. His energy is infinite, so he cannot overpower his own law, becasue he cannot overpower himself. And it's not a law of politics or anything, but a law of physics.

Aha. So god created everything, and when he did he cancelled his possibility to create anything else or overpower his creation by giving creation the same power as himself. So he cannot violate the laws he created and he cannot create what he created but he can see what happens and is concerned for his creations who he cannot help because he created a power as strong as himself that prevents him from doing so.

But he helps you say... how can he if he can't?

Also, then god wasn't omniscient before creating all because he would have known the implications of his acts meaning he would have known that he'd create sentient beings that would suffer and taht he wouldn't be able to help because of an opposing force equally powerful to him (that he created).

So all in all what you're talking about is (in a rather oxymoronic way)something like a deist god that didn't know the implications of his acts, or a masochistic deist god who enjoys suffering from seeing us suffer being unable to help us....

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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 4:18 am

Quote :
Also, science has proved that animals have "evolved" but has not proved they have evolved the way Darwin says they have.
How, praytell, have we not evolved as such?

Quote :
WAS there a reason to evolve
if by "reason" you mean envirnmental pressures and random mutation, then yep!

Quote :
Humans, we think, eveolved from guerrillas. Which is teh higher life form?
Said it before, say it again. Evolution is NOT a ladder. And in actuality the current apes themselves are evolved. We shared a common ancestor, we did NOT evolve from those currently around. They look wholy different now than our ancestors did so long ago.

Quote :
To achieve that lifeform, you would need extra information, actually lots of information, added to the existing DNA.
Yep. And that's what self replicating DNA that screws up is. Next?

Quote :
The placebo effect has been proven to sometimes cure sea sickness, as an example.
Yes it has. No one's said it hasn't. All hail the placebo effect.

Quote :
But taht is not controlled by a virus/ infection that comes from the external world. That, is controlled by our brain (sea sickness).
Which is why it tends to have a more sucessful effect on mental disorders than actual issues.

Quote :
If God was true, let's pretend, then he must have been the one who created science, in the first place. So how can God NOT be dragged into science, to question it?
Because "magic man done it" is NOT an answer.

Quote :
And you guys haven't yet answred my first post, about the oscilliting universe thing.
I don't know about them, but I have.

Quote :
God does not exist within the realm of time and space, but lives outside of it. And so, he doesn't have to adhere to these principles.
And thus he can NOT be a part of science anyway, because science deals with the tangible and testible, which God is not. So he can not be roven scientifically, which was what you originally proposed, so long ago.

Quote :
He creates a stone. One second, he can not lift it, becasue he uses his power to make him not be able to do so. The next second, he uses his power to make him be able to lift the stone. Now, he has created a stone he could not lift, and could lift.
But if he can no onger lift the stone, whether or not he took the power away, he is no longer all powerful, period.

Quote :
You think God wants to be praised all the time? he wants us to live in peace and harmony, and cares about us. He did not create us so that we could praise him.
That's not what the bible says, and you've given clues many times that you're a bible literalist, or at least picking and choosing, like most, and CHOOSE a literal Genisis account. Now, I have to go let my daughters be gangraped. It's righteous in the Lord's eyes.

Quote :
He created the laws of the universe and he can not over power himself, becasue its equeal energy. For example, he created the law that energy can not be created or destroyed, but only transformed. Therefore, he can not make food appear for the poor, because he can not overpower himself.
Doesn't sound all powerful to me. See, this is one of the contradictions with the claims made about God Himself. If you're all powerful, there's NOTHING you can't do, thus imposing rules upon yourself are arbitrary. If you can't bend the laws of nature once or twice, (Like he always did in the OT) then you're NOT all powerful.

Quote :
God lives outside the realm of time and space, and so he is not governed by his rules, but we are.
You just said he can't overpower the laws he created in this world....

Quote :
He could create teh universe, but we can't and with the universe we live in, energy can not be created, and so God can not transfer his energy here, because he cannot overpower himself.
But you just....

Quote :
Hey, don't forget about Satan.
Satan never did much evil, actualy. he was always acting under orders from God, except for the tauning of Christ/God, which CHrist/God allowed, so moot, and the apple thing. Which I don't blame him for. He was kicked out of heaven by a pretentious jerk and was a little miffed. He only took advantage of what God place into Adam and Eve in the first place. And made freinds with Lilith, Adam's FIRST wife.

Quote :
I already explained why he cannot help the people in Africa to an extent that great.
Doesn't sound all powerful to me. And if he can't. then why, praytell, are we calling him God? "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?" -Epicurus

Quote :
HE cannot overpower himslef, because he still wins.
No... that's simply a cotradiction, which is the issue with making God all powerful without limits.

Quote :
By creating a stone he cannot lift, he proves he ahs enough energy to do so.
No, it prooves he can not logically exist because he contradicts himself.

Quote :
Cancer cells don't die, but must be cut out, in one form or another.
Yeah they can. just not easy.

Quote :
How to kill the leader of a bad organization, for example.
Killed all the firstborn of Egypt. Sent entire armies and, with his divine blessing, made them win killing evil lords. Well, evil in that they didn't worship him. Etc. Not able to kill a single individual? Yeah....

Quote :
He cannot create a force of energy strong enough taht can overpower his own law of enegy not being able to be created in this universe, to kill this man, because taht would mean create something from nothing in this universe.
So he can't just tun him into a pillar of salt and be done with it? Move a mountain? inspire an entire army to win unequivicably? Create a pillar of fire? Rain fire from the heavens? Send an angel or two to jsut take the dude out? That's all I can think of at the second, but you get my point.

Quote :
He cannot create energy, and break his law, because that would mean having more energy than he has.
That's not all powerful and infinite.

Quote :
His energy is infinite, so he cannot overpower his own law, becasue he cannot overpower himself.
Are you aware of the level of contradiction your'e reaching?

Quote :
And it's not a law of politics or anything, but a law of physics.
Since you've said it before, I'll say it now. Laws of physics say nothing about the evolutionary theory.

_________________
"Jenaveve took everything from me.
My friends,
My family,
Everything!
Her ambitions to dominate the universe are terrifying,
Evil beyond imagining.
I,
Tyrong Kojy,
The one whose power even the creator fears,
Will stop her.
Even if I have to destroy the universe to do it!"
Tyrong Kojy/Jenaveve by Nicholas Rivest
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alexCCCP-RUS-54321
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 4:20 am

Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:
Alex wrote:
He created the laws of the universe and he can not over power himself, becasue its equeal energy.

This, Alex, doesn't make sense. So he opposes himself? You he exists and doesn't exist? So he's a contradiction?

Alex wrote:

For example, he created the law that energy can not be created or destroyed, but only transformed.

But he created matter so he nulified his own law.

Alex wrote:

Therefore, he can not make food appear for the poor, because he can not overpower himself.

Aha... so he cannot help because he has forbidden himself to help. But he helps right?

Alex wrote:

God lives outside the realm of time and space, and so he is not governed by his rules, but we are.

So he's not governed by his rules but... wait seemingly according to you he is:
Alex wrote:
He created the laws of the universe and he can not over power himself, becasue its equeal energy.

See? So not and yes, but yes and no. In the end (and begining) none and all.



Alex wrote:

He could create teh universe, but we can't and with the universe we live in, energy can not be created, and so God can not transfer his energy here, because he cannot overpower himself.

Yeah because he's not governed by his laws right? So he can violate them and transport some 1,000 million T-bones to the starvelings around the world.

Alex wrote:

Hey, don't forget about Satan.

I had sex with him yesterday, how could I forget him/her/it? It' was a two-individuals orgy!

Wait... are you implying Satan is god's self-prohibition?

Alex wrote:

I already explained why he cannot help the people in Africa to an extent that great.

Yup, through an oxymoron. So he's omnipotently powerless.

Alex wrote:

And I just realized, by creating a stone he cannot lift, he is still allpowerfull, becasue he has created a stone with infinite weight, which takes infinite energy. By doing so, he is allpowerfull. HE cannot overpower himslef, because he still wins. By creating a stone he cannot lift, he proves he ahs enough energy to do so.

So gof creates a god that creates a god to create a god....

Even so... did you know that so far no stone within Earth is of infinite weight? I'm sure god could lift it.


Alex wrote:

The greatest evil is the one that doesn't die.

Why did Lord almighty let those evils be born in the first place?

Why would he create evil he cannot overpower?

Alex wrote:

Cancer cells don't die, but must be cut out, in one form or another. He can't change our lives in some ways, because of teh lawws he created that don't let him do so.

Aha. Because he's not governed by the laws that govern us but he is... nonetheless he can help.


Alex wrote:

How to kill the leader of a bad organization, for example.

What the hell???

Alex wrote:

He cannot create a force of energy strong enough taht can overpower his own law of enegy not being able to be created in this universe, to kill this man, [u]because taht would mean create something from nothing in this universe.[/b]

Which is, according to yourself what he did in the first place by creating all?

Alex wrote:

He cannot create energy, and break his law, because that would mean having more energy than he has.

But he did create everything so he did break it. Or are you talking about a Deist god that condemned himself to eternal repentment for creating factors that make us suffer that he can't overcome but yet see?

Ah, but he helps!

Alex wrote:

By having more energy, teh law is stronger, and so equeally is his energy. His energy is infinite, so he cannot overpower his own law, becasue he cannot overpower himself. And it's not a law of politics or anything, but a law of physics.

Aha. So god created everything, and when he did he cancelled his possibility to create anything else or overpower his creation by giving creation the same power as himself. So he cannot violate the laws he created and he cannot create what he created but he can see what happens and is concerned for his creations who he cannot help because he created a power as strong as himself that prevents him from doing so.

But he helps you say... how can he if he can't?

Also, then god wasn't omniscient before creating all because he would have known the implications of his acts meaning he would have known that he'd create sentient beings that would suffer and taht he wouldn't be able to help because of an opposing force equally powerful to him (that he created).

So all in all what you're talking about is (in a rather oxymoronic way)something like a deist god that didn't know the implications of his acts, or a masochistic deist god who enjoys suffering from seeing us suffer being unable to help us....
He could create teh universe, but cannot change it.

He can help someways, but not in others. He could in the beggining of the creation of the universe becasue he did not create those laws until he created them, which, of course, mut of been after the creation of teh universe.

He's not governed by his own laws, becasue he lives out of the realm of time and space. But when THIS universe is put into the equasion, he cannot. To make nothing appear from something is impossible, in this universe, becasue God's power made it so. There was energy before the satrt of the universe, the energy in God. But God doesn't have the nergy to create things from no where, beacause he cannot overpower himself. When god created the universe, he could bacause the energy to create it was already there, within God. But to make food appear out of thin air is impossible. God has given teh earth a way to renew soil, air, water, etc. What they do with it is up to them.

It's confusing and jumblled i know, and i'm sorry. I'll leave you with this for now.
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alexCCCP-RUS-54321
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 4:22 am

Tyrong Kojy wrote:
Quote :
Also, science has proved that animals have "evolved" but has not proved they have evolved the way Darwin says they have.
How, praytell, have we not evolved as such?

Quote :
WAS there a reason to evolve
if by "reason" you mean envirnmental pressures and random mutation, then yep!

Quote :
Humans, we think, eveolved from guerrillas. Which is teh higher life form?
Said it before, say it again. Evolution is NOT a ladder. And in actuality the current apes themselves are evolved. We shared a common ancestor, we did NOT evolve from those currently around. They look wholy different now than our ancestors did so long ago.

Quote :
To achieve that lifeform, you would need extra information, actually lots of information, added to the existing DNA.
Yep. And that's what self replicating DNA that screws up is. Next?

Quote :
The placebo effect has been proven to sometimes cure sea sickness, as an example.
Yes it has. No one's said it hasn't. All hail the placebo effect.

Quote :
But taht is not controlled by a virus/ infection that comes from the external world. That, is controlled by our brain (sea sickness).
Which is why it tends to have a more sucessful effect on mental disorders than actual issues.

Quote :
If God was true, let's pretend, then he must have been the one who created science, in the first place. So how can God NOT be dragged into science, to question it?
Because "magic man done it" is NOT an answer.

Quote :
And you guys haven't yet answred my first post, about the oscilliting universe thing.
I don't know about them, but I have.

Quote :
God does not exist within the realm of time and space, but lives outside of it. And so, he doesn't have to adhere to these principles.
And thus he can NOT be a part of science anyway, because science deals with the tangible and testible, which God is not. So he can not be roven scientifically, which was what you originally proposed, so long ago.

Quote :
He creates a stone. One second, he can not lift it, becasue he uses his power to make him not be able to do so. The next second, he uses his power to make him be able to lift the stone. Now, he has created a stone he could not lift, and could lift.
But if he can no onger lift the stone, whether or not he took the power away, he is no longer all powerful, period.

Quote :
You think God wants to be praised all the time? he wants us to live in peace and harmony, and cares about us. He did not create us so that we could praise him.
That's not what the bible says, and you've given clues many times that you're a bible literalist, or at least picking and choosing, like most, and CHOOSE a literal Genisis account. Now, I have to go let my daughters be gangraped. It's righteous in the Lord's eyes.

Quote :
He created the laws of the universe and he can not over power himself, becasue its equeal energy. For example, he created the law that energy can not be created or destroyed, but only transformed. Therefore, he can not make food appear for the poor, because he can not overpower himself.
Doesn't sound all powerful to me. See, this is one of the contradictions with the claims made about God Himself. If you're all powerful, there's NOTHING you can't do, thus imposing rules upon yourself are arbitrary. If you can't bend the laws of nature once or twice, (Like he always did in the OT) then you're NOT all powerful.

Quote :
God lives outside the realm of time and space, and so he is not governed by his rules, but we are.
You just said he can't overpower the laws he created in this world....

Quote :
He could create teh universe, but we can't and with the universe we live in, energy can not be created, and so God can not transfer his energy here, because he cannot overpower himself.
But you just....

Quote :
Hey, don't forget about Satan.
Satan never did much evil, actualy. he was always acting under orders from God, except for the tauning of Christ/God, which CHrist/God allowed, so moot, and the apple thing. Which I don't blame him for. He was kicked out of heaven by a pretentious jerk and was a little miffed. He only took advantage of what God place into Adam and Eve in the first place. And made freinds with Lilith, Adam's FIRST wife.

Quote :
I already explained why he cannot help the people in Africa to an extent that great.
Doesn't sound all powerful to me. And if he can't. then why, praytell, are we calling him God? "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?" -Epicurus

Quote :
HE cannot overpower himslef, because he still wins.
No... that's simply a cotradiction, which is the issue with making God all powerful without limits.

Quote :
By creating a stone he cannot lift, he proves he ahs enough energy to do so.
No, it prooves he can not logically exist because he contradicts himself.

Quote :
Cancer cells don't die, but must be cut out, in one form or another.
Yeah they can. just not easy.

Quote :
How to kill the leader of a bad organization, for example.
Killed all the firstborn of Egypt. Sent entire armies and, with his divine blessing, made them win killing evil lords. Well, evil in that they didn't worship him. Etc. Not able to kill a single individual? Yeah....

Quote :
He cannot create a force of energy strong enough taht can overpower his own law of enegy not being able to be created in this universe, to kill this man, because taht would mean create something from nothing in this universe.
So he can't just tun him into a pillar of salt and be done with it? Move a mountain? inspire an entire army to win unequivicably? Create a pillar of fire? Rain fire from the heavens? Send an angel or two to jsut take the dude out? That's all I can think of at the second, but you get my point.

Quote :
He cannot create energy, and break his law, because that would mean having more energy than he has.
That's not all powerful and infinite.

Quote :
His energy is infinite, so he cannot overpower his own law, becasue he cannot overpower himself.
Are you aware of the level of contradiction your'e reaching?

Quote :
And it's not a law of politics or anything, but a law of physics.
Since you've said it before, I'll say it now. Laws of physics say nothing about the evolutionary theory.
The universe is complicated. Contradiction may be the way it works. Not in a logical manner.

And I'm talking about OScilliting theory at the momnent! I just replied to those evloution things cuz Enviro asked me teh question.

Sorry.

Did God create us to be praised? No.Should we praise him? Yes. Thank shim for what he's given us.
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 4:36 am

alexCCCP-RUS-54321 wrote:


He can help someways, but not in others. He could in the beggining of the creation of the universe becasue he did not create those laws until he created them, which, of course, mut of been after the creation of teh universe.


Youre just contradicting yourself. He lives outside time and space and so he can't help but he can't... what's next?

Alex wrote:

He's not governed by his own laws, becasue he lives out of the realm of time and space. But when THIS universe is put into the equasion, he cannot.

Aha... so this universe literally overpowers him. Hi creation overpowers him.

Tyrong's quote of Epicurus pretty much summarizes what I'd say.


Alex wrote:
To make nothing appear from something is impossible, in this universe, becasue God's power made it so.
There was energy before the satrt of the universe, the energy in God. But God doesn't have the nergy to create things from no where, beacause he cannot overpower himself. When god created the universe, he could bacause the energy to create it was already there, within God. But to make food appear out of thin air is impossible. God has given teh earth a way to renew soil, air, water, etc. What they do with it is up to them.

Aha... hey you know he could actually gather a bunch of Asteroids by manipulating gravity and say "Hey, I am god, and I want you to behave!"

Is tha also impossible for him? Ah yes because he can't overpower himself...


Alex wrote:

It's confusing and jumblled i know, and i'm sorry. I'll leave you with this for now.

You didn't even adress my points. And you keep contradicting yourself.

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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 4:36 am

Quote :
God is responsibe for good, Satan for bad.
That is most wholehartedly incorrect. God even said, literally, that his name is evil. And he CREATED Satan, so....

Quote :
God Fights Satan. As simple as that.
Except when he makes bets with him about the faith of certain believers, like, say, Job.

Quote :
How can you create intelligence without having intlligence to realize what intelligence is?
That... doesn't make an sence....

Quote :
It taeks time to evelove.
All hail time.

Quote :
If there is a threat to survival serious enough to trigger adaptation, you think the organism would have enugh time to evolve, to meet it?
The environment does not trigger the mutation, nor can the creature CHOOSE what mutates. If you're saying most would die out, you're right. 99.99% of ALL LIFE has died out.

Quote :
Do we know for sure how species evolved, why?
Peppered moths of Britan, geckos of the rockies (I think, could be wrong on the location) Darwin's finches, flies, cockroaches, microorganisms, and this without DNA evidence or fossil records.

Quote :
The crossing of chromosones or something like that...But how would teh orgnaisms know how to evlove?
Two points up.

Quote :
What would trigger their DNA to change, and in what way?
Previous post. You guys went ahead of me.

Quote :
Let's say you had two legs. Then your DNA "evolved" and soyou grow a tail.
You'd grow a tail in 100+ years, at least, depending on breeding rate.

Quote :
Would you need more DNA to get an extra tail?
Yep.

Quote :
Yes you would, and where would that come from?
A mistake brought on by the splitting of DNA chains, usually within Sperm/egg or in utero, or however your specific species breeds.

Quote :
Well mayeb he did
Please copy, paste, and quote like us. It takeslonger, yes, but we know what you're talking about.

Quote :
With the universe as we know it, teh universe is ever expanding. All recent data points to the universe being ever expanding? Do you deny the universe being ever expanding? Back up your claim, please?
I'm not repeating myself again. Said it several times in PM, said it here. Stop talking about it. Now.

Quote :
Im trying to prove the possibility of God as a serious option. But maybe proving the oscilliting universe theory wrong, it would be onse step...
Wrong! You're tryin to proove the possibility of the CHRISTIAN God as a possibility! All you;re doing is providing some rather allright arguments for the desit God, that being we can't know for sure. But ALL other GOds have failed the test, so as far as I'm concerned so does the deist one. What's more, again, "magic man done it" answers nothing.

Quote :
Is teh universe is ever-expanding, then the iscilliting universe theory is no more. I'm trying to show that. By acknowledging that the universe is ever expanding, it means the teh oscilliting universe theory is not right. That's what it tells you.
I presented the oscilating universe as a POSSIBILITY of a WAY the universe COULD expand and contract eternally, and this was before I found out a COUPLE new things, which are all ultimately moot, since that ONE theory going out the window does not proove God. If you bring this up ONE more time, I swear....

Quote :
That's why priests wear crosses, right? It represents Jesus' sacrifice. (Not only taht, however
No, it's holy status as something good was, like many other things in Christianity, adopted from pagans.

Quote :
something like a deist god that didn't know the implications of his acts
That's from Zealot. OR the deist God just likes creating universes. That also works. Boredom. likes creating. Etc.

_________________
"Jenaveve took everything from me.
My friends,
My family,
Everything!
Her ambitions to dominate the universe are terrifying,
Evil beyond imagining.
I,
Tyrong Kojy,
The one whose power even the creator fears,
Will stop her.
Even if I have to destroy the universe to do it!"
Tyrong Kojy/Jenaveve by Nicholas Rivest
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 4:37 am

STOP POSTING AND LET ME CATCH UP!

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"Jenaveve took everything from me.
My friends,
My family,
Everything!
Her ambitions to dominate the universe are terrifying,
Evil beyond imagining.
I,
Tyrong Kojy,
The one whose power even the creator fears,
Will stop her.
Even if I have to destroy the universe to do it!"
Tyrong Kojy/Jenaveve by Nicholas Rivest
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 4:44 am

Tyrong Kojy wrote:


Quote :
something like a deist god that didn't know the implications of his acts
That's from Zealot. OR the deist God just likes creating universes. That also works. Boredom. likes creating. Etc.

No, no, no. He cares about us. But he didn't know how things would come out: the way he did them, we'd suffer and he couldn't be able to do anything but be aware of it so he'd suffer because he wouldn't have wanted us to suffer.

That's what I tried to imply.


Also this is becoming senseless.


And Alex: Forget the oscillating universe theory, it's not relevant at all. You know why I even talked about it? Because I'd love it to be that way, as simple as that and I can choose to believe it could be that way since there's no certainty about the topic. Either way, it's just a possibility, that's all. However, all you're saying is flawed from a completely different standpoint: a logical one. You write hundred-words-long oxymorons and expect them to serve as arguements.

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alexCCCP-RUS-54321
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 4:51 am

Tyrong Kojy wrote:
Quote :
God is responsibe for good, Satan for bad.
That is most wholehartedly incorrect. God even said, literally, that his name is evil. And he CREATED Satan, so....

Quote :
God Fights Satan. As simple as that.
Except when he makes bets with him about the faith of certain believers, like, say, Job.

Quote :
How can you create intelligence without having intlligence to realize what intelligence is?
That... doesn't make an sence....

Quote :
It taeks time to evelove.
All hail time.

Quote :
If there is a threat to survival serious enough to trigger adaptation, you think the organism would have enugh time to evolve, to meet it?
The environment does not trigger the mutation, nor can the creature CHOOSE what mutates. If you're saying most would die out, you're right. 99.99% of ALL LIFE has died out.

Quote :
Do we know for sure how species evolved, why?
Peppered moths of Britan, geckos of the rockies (I think, could be wrong on the location) Darwin's finches, flies, cockroaches, microorganisms, and this without DNA evidence or fossil records.

Quote :
The crossing of chromosones or something like that...But how would teh orgnaisms know how to evlove?
Two points up.

Quote :
What would trigger their DNA to change, and in what way?
Previous post. You guys went ahead of me.

Quote :
Let's say you had two legs. Then your DNA "evolved" and soyou grow a tail.
You'd grow a tail in 100+ years, at least, depending on breeding rate.

Quote :
Would you need more DNA to get an extra tail?
Yep.

Quote :
Yes you would, and where would that come from?
A mistake brought on by the splitting of DNA chains, usually within Sperm/egg or in utero, or however your specific species breeds.

Quote :
Well mayeb he did
Please copy, paste, and quote like us. It takeslonger, yes, but we know what you're talking about.

Quote :
With the universe as we know it, teh universe is ever expanding. All recent data points to the universe being ever expanding? Do you deny the universe being ever expanding? Back up your claim, please?
I'm not repeating myself again. Said it several times in PM, said it here. Stop talking about it. Now.

Quote :
Im trying to prove the possibility of God as a serious option. But maybe proving the oscilliting universe theory wrong, it would be onse step...
Wrong! You're tryin to proove the possibility of the CHRISTIAN God as a possibility! All you;re doing is providing some rather allright arguments for the desit God, that being we can't know for sure. But ALL other GOds have failed the test, so as far as I'm concerned so does the deist one. What's more, again, "magic man done it" answers nothing.

Quote :
Is teh universe is ever-expanding, then the iscilliting universe theory is no more. I'm trying to show that. By acknowledging that the universe is ever expanding, it means the teh oscilliting universe theory is not right. That's what it tells you.
I presented the oscilating universe as a POSSIBILITY of a WAY the universe COULD expand and contract eternally, and this was before I found out a COUPLE new things, which are all ultimately moot, since that ONE theory going out the window does not proove God. If you bring this up ONE more time, I swear....

Quote :
That's why priests wear crosses, right? It represents Jesus' sacrifice. (Not only taht, however
No, it's holy status as something good was, like many other things in Christianity, adopted from pagans.

Quote :
something like a deist god that didn't know the implications of his acts
That's from Zealot. OR the deist God just likes creating universes. That also works. Boredom. likes creating. Etc.
Satan WAS teh angel of light.

yes it does make sense.

That moth thing doesn't answer my Q.

taht mistake wouldn't be enough to add taht much inofrmation.

What the hell do you mean. Do you acknowledge that scietists believe teh universe is ever expanding? Yes, or nMost relegions refer to one go, with different rpophets and different interpretations.

I NEVER SAID IT PORVES GOD. I SAID IT'S A STEP TO MAKING GOD A SERIOUS OPTION FOR TEH VREATION OF THE UNIVERSE!!!!
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 4:52 am

Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:
Tyrong Kojy wrote:


Quote :
something like a deist god that didn't know the implications of his acts
That's from Zealot. OR the deist God just likes creating universes. That also works. Boredom. likes creating. Etc.

No, no, no. He cares about us. But he didn't know how things would come out: the way he did them, we'd suffer and he couldn't be able to do anything but be aware of it so he'd suffer because he wouldn't have wanted us to suffer.

That's what I tried to imply.


Also this is becoming senseless.


And Alex: Forget the oscillating universe theory, it's not relevant at all. You know why I even talked about it? Because I'd love it to be that way, as simple as that and I can choose to believe it could be that way since there's no certainty about the topic. Either way, it's just a possibility, that's all. However, all you're saying is flawed from a completely different standpoint: a logical one. You write hundred-words-long oxymorons and expect them to serve as arguements.
You're interpreting them as oxymorons, and so I'll calrify teh points. But tommorow. I'm not sure taht God exists. I'm trying to explain why he could.
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 4:58 am

Quote :
He could create teh universe, but cannot change it.
Then he is not all powerful, and not worthy of worship anyway.

Quote :
He can help someways, but not in others. He could in the beggining of the creation of the universe becasue he did not create those laws until he created them, which, of course, mut of been after the creation of teh universe.
And by help, you mean curing masses of sick with his touch, and feeding 10,000 with a couple loaves of bread and a couple fish? Stuff like that?

Quote :
He's not governed by his own laws, becasue he lives out of the realm of time and space.
And thus can not be proven by science, said it already....

Quote :
To make nothing appear from something is impossible, in this universe, becasue God's power made it so.
And if he can not change those laws, liek all the others he did, like stopping the sun in the sky to give what's his name more time to win his battle, then he is not all powerful.

Quote :
There was energy before the satrt of the universe, the energy in God.
You're just naming the previous state of the univers God, and giving it a "face". I can do that with flowers, or ham sandwinches. (Holds up a ham sandwinch.) This is a glabeesh. most call it a ham sandwinch, I call it a Glabeesh. It is my God.

Quote :
But to make food appear out of thin air is impossible.
To feed the suposed 10,000 with what was said would require that each get a piece less than microscopic. Which means that either the nutrition, or the food, would be created "out of nothing". Oh, and you ever hear of quarks? THey appear and dissapear. Go to my youtube channel. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pw-KpF-9_bI This series of videos explains it. i can't recall what one. (I might be wrong calling them quarks. I might also be wrong about them being in those vids, it might be a favourite I have. If so, please tell and I'll try to find it.)

Quote :
God has given teh earth a way to renew soil, air, water, etc. What they do with it is up to them.
Soil? Water? You DO know that most of the soil we can't live on without technology, and we can't even drink most of the water, right?

Quote :
The universe is complicated. Contradiction may be the way it works. Not in a logical manner.
Your point? I'm not saying the universe is contradictory, I'm saying God is.

Quote :
And I'm talking about OScilliting theory at the momnent!
And now you'll stop talking about it, since I;ve replied several times now.

Quote :
I just replied to those evloution things cuz Enviro asked me teh question.
I was referring to long ago previous posts in other topics.

Quote :
Sorry.
For what? Copy, quote, paste, close quote. PLEASE. it can all be done through replies. Or number the exact paragraph you're talking to, at the least if you can't be bothered.

Quote :
Did God create us to be praised? No.Should we praise him? Yes. Thank shim for what he's given us.
Thank you for milipedes, smallpox, bubonic plague, great whites, quicksand, flu, flesh eating virus, leprosy, cancer, radiation, poison ivy, fire ants, african bees, lions, tigers, bears, oh my, 70% of the Earth not letting us live on, let alone drink, most of what's left being too hot or too cold to live on without science to help, opium, rabies, schitsophrenia, electrical shock, asteroids, solar flares, black holes, rongue comets, other galaxies we're going to ram, a crappy pelvic bone grinding against our spine, which is curved so that our nerves are pinched painfully, testicles that get pinched just by moving, monthly bleeding, a constant need to eat, the need to be unconcious for 1/3 of our lives, such a limited color spectrum with which or poor eyes can see, our blind spot, crappy olfactory sences, stingrays, and creationists.

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"Jenaveve took everything from me.
My friends,
My family,
Everything!
Her ambitions to dominate the universe are terrifying,
Evil beyond imagining.
I,
Tyrong Kojy,
The one whose power even the creator fears,
Will stop her.
Even if I have to destroy the universe to do it!"
Tyrong Kojy/Jenaveve by Nicholas Rivest
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 5:09 am

First, QUOTE AND PASTE, OR NUMBER.

Quote :
Satan WAS teh angel of light.
And if God was all knowing he knew exactly what would happen, etc.

Quote :
yes it does make sense.
What does? No idea what you're talking about.

Quote :
That moth thing doesn't answer my Q.
Youa sked for visible effects of evolution. Give it at most 100 years and only brown may come about, comepletely breeding out ALL white genes. And you're saying nothing about the gekoes, or whatever, viruses, or finches. ANd I think there was another,but I'm not searching through all that.

Quote :
taht mistake wouldn't be enough to add taht much inofrmation.
You're right. Give it 10,000 years and many more mutations in that specific point and it will. Oh.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQYAHwKRbMs

Quote :
What the hell do you mean. Do you acknowledge that scietists believe teh universe is ever expanding? Yes, or n
Are you talking about the oscilating universe again? The one I told you to stop, because I was tired of hearing it and repeating myself over and over again?

Quote :
Most relegions refer to one go, with different rpophets and different interpretations.
Like how the Bhudists say the world was breathed out by a dragon? Are you literally saying that all creation myths are more or less the same? Do your reseach in this matter, man. The three desert Godf, yes, because they're all based off each other. The rest? They're all over the place.

Quote :
I NEVER SAID IT PORVES GOD. I SAID IT'S A STEP TO MAKING GOD A SERIOUS OPTION FOR TEH VREATION OF THE UNIVERSE!!!!
Deist, not Christian, and it only adds new questions because "magic man done it" tells nothing.

Quote :
I'm not sure taht God exists.
I SO want to swear..... Bullcrap in a hand basket, you are. You're the one who says evolution is impossible, and you're the one talking about Satan,a nd all that You're sure he exists, now stop trying to sound like the one of reason, because you're not.

_________________
"Jenaveve took everything from me.
My friends,
My family,
Everything!
Her ambitions to dominate the universe are terrifying,
Evil beyond imagining.
I,
Tyrong Kojy,
The one whose power even the creator fears,
Will stop her.
Even if I have to destroy the universe to do it!"
Tyrong Kojy/Jenaveve by Nicholas Rivest
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 5:12 am

i came in a little late
but the problem is
the human boody has many problems left over from animals
our guts joined at wrong places
eyes wired backwards
the apendix
and if darwin is wrong, why is it you who is automatically right

its the THEORY of evolution
do you know what THOERY means? appparently not
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 5:41 am

Quote :
apendix
Actually t DOES still have a use. Diareah. Normally there's bacteria that helps with digestion the the intestine. When there's an infection, those bacteria reteat into the apendix. After the infection is flushed, those bacteria come back out.

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"Jenaveve took everything from me.
My friends,
My family,
Everything!
Her ambitions to dominate the universe are terrifying,
Evil beyond imagining.
I,
Tyrong Kojy,
The one whose power even the creator fears,
Will stop her.
Even if I have to destroy the universe to do it!"
Tyrong Kojy/Jenaveve by Nicholas Rivest
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 6:11 am

alexCCCP-RUS-54321 wrote:
You're interpreting them as oxymorons, and so I'll calrify teh points. But tommorow. I'm not sure taht God exists. I'm trying to explain why he could.


NO ONE HERE DENIED THE POSSIBILITY THAT GOD MAY EXIST. No one said "God is impossible".

There were two premises:

Tyrong's: There's no proof for god therefore I don't believe in his existance.

Mine: God is possible so I prefer to believe he exists.

You engaged in a weeks long pointless "debate" over a false premise and employing entirely flawed arguements...

This is an apalling example of lack of comunication.

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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 6:26 am

Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:
alexCCCP-RUS-54321 wrote:
You're interpreting them as oxymorons, and so I'll calrify teh points. But tommorow. I'm not sure taht God exists. I'm trying to explain why he could.


NO ONE HERE DENIED THE POSSIBILITY THAT GOD MAY EXIST. No one said "God is impossible".

There were two premises:

Tyrong's: There's no proof for god therefore I don't believe in his existance.

Mine: God is possible so I prefer to believe he exists.

You engaged in a weeks long pointless "debate" over a false premise and employing entirely flawed arguements...

This is an apalling example of lack of comunication.
I'v ebeen replying to you cuz others haven't been asking questions. I'm trying to show Tyrong that God is a fair possibility, not that he's right. And I'm not only discussing to prove, but aslo to learn.
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 6:44 am

And I have already, several times now, admitted that the deist God is possible. However you started this, and have at many points throughout indicated, that it is the CHRISTIAN God you're trying to proove.

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My friends,
My family,
Everything!
Her ambitions to dominate the universe are terrifying,
Evil beyond imagining.
I,
Tyrong Kojy,
The one whose power even the creator fears,
Will stop her.
Even if I have to destroy the universe to do it!"
Tyrong Kojy/Jenaveve by Nicholas Rivest
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 7:31 am

alexCCCP-RUS-54321 wrote:
I'v ebeen replying to you cuz others haven't been asking questions. I'm trying to show Tyrong that God is a fair possibility, not that he's right. And I'm not only discussing to prove, but aslo to learn.

Tyrong has admited more than once to the possibility of a god. You once even claimed to have "proof for god's existance" and neither Tyrong nor thread titles will let me lie. And, as Tyrong pointed out above, you've hinted taht it's teh christian god which, by all logical means, has been rebutted but which if for any chance existed, would be terribly evil and sadistic.

Do you want to discuss Agnosticism, gnosticism, theism and atheism or do you want to discuss creationism and the Judeochristian god? Because, believe it or not, there's a gigantic gap between several of those concepts.

If your point is that god is possible, yes, it has been admited several times already.

If your point is that the Christian god is possible, then you got to forget about all your science based arguements and stick to Christian scriptures and to Christianity itself of which premises I guarantee you will be logically obliterated here as they have been already elsewhere.

I should note, though, that you even hint to not being adept to the Judeochristian god since, for example, you say god doesn't demand being worshipped. The Judeochristian god demands it to the extent of threattening with eternal damnation if said worship is not fulfilled.

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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 7:37 am

Quote :
If your point is that the Christian god is possible, then you got to forget about all your science based arguements and stick to Christian scriptures and to Christianity itself of which premises I guarantee you will be logically obliterated here as they have been already elsewhere.
He did his very first time, remember? Perfection of the world? Perfection of our orbit? Etc?

_________________
"Jenaveve took everything from me.
My friends,
My family,
Everything!
Her ambitions to dominate the universe are terrifying,
Evil beyond imagining.
I,
Tyrong Kojy,
The one whose power even the creator fears,
Will stop her.
Even if I have to destroy the universe to do it!"
Tyrong Kojy/Jenaveve by Nicholas Rivest
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 7:40 am

Tyrong Kojy wrote:
He did his very first time, remember? Perfection of the world? Perfection of our orbit? Etc?

That seems more like an argument for ID than for Christian god. He did however try to defend Creationism with his "geological evidence". But I want him to define his position in a very clear way now so we can move on with this discussion and get out of this loop we've fallen into.

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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 6:55 pm

Quote :
get out of this loop we've fallen into
Like theoscilating theory crap that's beed adressed in every way many times now?

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"Jenaveve took everything from me.
My friends,
My family,
Everything!
Her ambitions to dominate the universe are terrifying,
Evil beyond imagining.
I,
Tyrong Kojy,
The one whose power even the creator fears,
Will stop her.
Even if I have to destroy the universe to do it!"
Tyrong Kojy/Jenaveve by Nicholas Rivest
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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Fri May 08, 2009 7:02 pm

Tyrong Kojy wrote:
Like theoscilating theory crap that's beed adressed in every way many times now?

Specially that. Its repetitiveness and lack of coherence has got me on the verge of a headache...

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PostSubject: Re: Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security   Today at 4:27 pm

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Freakin Kaspersky- The Russian Anti-Virus Internet Security
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