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 Most well read in Marxist theory ?

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Watermelon
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 2:27 am

From my reading on Marxists Internet Archive at marxists.org I know that kautsky said that socialist consciousness can only come from the intellectuals, and Penin agreed and said the intellectuals are bourgeoisie who break off and very advanced proletariat. These combine to form the revolutionary vanguard.
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 2:54 am

Pannekoek wrote:
From my reading on Marxists Internet Archive at marxists.org I know that kautsky said that socialist consciousness can only come from the intellectuals, and Penin agreed and said the intellectuals are bourgeoisie who break off and very advanced proletariat. These combine to form the revolutionary vanguard.

Its in the interest of petty bourgeoisie intellectuals to join the proletariat because they realize their class faces extinction at the hands of the bourgeoisie.
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 2:58 am

They will join the proletariat because monopoly capitalism destroys them.
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 3:04 am

Pannekoek wrote:
They will join the proletariat because monopoly capitalism destroys them.

Looks like you know a bit about Marxism Very Happy
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Watermelon
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 3:09 am

A bit.
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:05 am

No

Just like the peasants in th USSR

The petty Bourgeoisie can sympathize with the ruling class or the proletariat.

Some aspire to become true capitalist and will possibly come to their aid in socialist revolution. They are winnable but not already predetermined.

Inkus, you talking marxism makes me sick to my stomach.
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inkus2000
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:11 am

MarxistFreeman wrote:
No

Just like the peasants in th USSR

The petty Bourgeoisie can sympathize with the ruling class or the proletariat.

Some aspire to become true capitalist and will possibly come to their aid in socialist revolution. They are winnable but not already predetermined.

Inkus, you talking marxism makes me sick to my stomach.

Ah your misplaced anger is most humorous

It reminds me of a time when I was a naive flag waving extremist like yourself.


ah memories
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:14 am

inkus2000 wrote:
MarxistFreeman wrote:
No

Just like the peasants in th USSR

The petty Bourgeoisie can sympathize with the ruling class or the proletariat.

Some aspire to become true capitalist and will possibly come to their aid in socialist revolution. They are winnable but not already predetermined.

Inkus, you talking marxism makes me sick to my stomach.

Ah your misplaced anger is most humorous

It reminds me of a time when I was a naive flag waving extremist like yourself.


ah memories

flag waiver?

cause im totally a nationalist.

You're a goddamn social democrat. Your politics are the most poisonous for the working class. You told me to vote for obama to combat racism for crying out loud and then you have th e audacity to call yourself a marxist.

disgusting
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Watermelon
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:16 am

When capitalism is fully developed the petty bourgeoisie will have effectively vanished.
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:17 am

Pannekoek wrote:
When capitalism is fully developed the petty bourgeoisie will have effectively vanished.

capitalism has already developed fully

We have imperialist nations now which is the highest stage of capitalism.

Revolution will simply polarize the petty bourgeois
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inkus2000
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:19 am

MarxistFreeman wrote:
inkus2000 wrote:
MarxistFreeman wrote:
No

Just like the peasants in th USSR

The petty Bourgeoisie can sympathize with the ruling class or the proletariat.

Some aspire to become true capitalist and will possibly come to their aid in socialist revolution. They are winnable but not already predetermined.

Inkus, you talking marxism makes me sick to my stomach.

Ah your misplaced anger is most humorous

It reminds me of a time when I was a naive flag waving extremist like yourself.


ah memories

flag waiver?

cause im totally a nationalist.

You're a goddamn social democrat. Your politics are the most poisonous for the working class. You told me to vote for obama to combat racism for crying out loud and then you have th e audacity to call yourself a marxist.

disgusting

Voting for Obama will do more for the working class than wasting your vote on someone who wont be elected.

Giving poor people free healthcare, would be the more 'socialist' thing to do, no said you have to agree with the dems but they are the lesser of the two evils.
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:22 am

What does one vote do? Nothing. Your time is better spent on this forum.
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:23 am

Quote :
You're a goddamn social democrat. Your politics are the most poisonous for the working class. You told me to vote for obama to combat racism for crying out loud and then you have th e audacity to call yourself a marxist.

Im not a Marxist, Im a socialist.
Socialism pre dates Marx, Marx was an brilliant man but I don't agree with everything he wrote and neither should you - make up your own mind.
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:24 am

Obama is for self help

The democrats defeated welfare and effectively converted it into a union busting technique.

You even have illusions in the capitalist state...mr Marxist
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:25 am

premarxist socialism was Utopian. Marxism is scientific socialism.
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:26 am

MarxistFreeman wrote:
Obama is for self help

The democrats defeated welfare and effectively converted it into a union busting technique.

You even have illusions in the capitalist state...mr Marxist

Id laugh if your the reason McCain gets in. Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:27 am

inkus2000 wrote:
MarxistFreeman wrote:
Obama is for self help

The democrats defeated welfare and effectively converted it into a union busting technique.

You even have illusions in the capitalist state...mr Marxist

Id laugh if your the reason McCain gets in. Very Happy

You know what Mccain had DAMN similar policies to Obama class wise.

I WANT Obama to win so that I can better show people that it doesn't matter WHO lays hands on the ready made state machinery, IT CANNOT be reformed to benefit the working class
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:29 am

Wuauw, one vote does a lot. The workers have so much control over the state in the bourgeois bureaucracy, which by the way reformists necessarily support.
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:31 am

MarxistFreeman wrote:
inkus2000 wrote:
MarxistFreeman wrote:
Obama is for self help

The democrats defeated welfare and effectively converted it into a union busting technique.

You even have illusions in the capitalist state...mr Marxist

Id laugh if your the reason McCain gets in. Very Happy

You know what Mccain had DAMN similar policies to Obama class wise.

I WANT Obama to win so that I can better show people that it doesn't matter WHO lays hands on the ready made state machinery, IT CANNOT be reformed to benefit the working class


Whatever, Obamma isnt as bad as McCain and you only have two options.
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:32 am

ralf nader. cynthia mckinney. whoever for the libertarianz.
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:36 am

lol and as a marxist you look to capitalists as your only means of winning workers' gains...

good job
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:38 am

i was just naming pepul. good nite.
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:40 am

i meant inkus

i actually LIKE you emy lol
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:55 am

MarxistFreeman wrote:
lol and as a marxist you look to capitalists as your only means of winning workers' gains...

good job


Again not a Marxist, a socialist .
Your assumption that all socialists are Marxists identifies your ignorance.
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PostSubject: Re: Most well read in Marxist theory ?   Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:57 am

inkus2000 wrote:
MarxistFreeman wrote:
lol and as a marxist you look to capitalists as your only means of winning workers' gains...

good job


Again not a Marxist, a socialist .
Your assumption that all socialists are Marxists identifies your ignorance.

you've made that perfectly clear that not all socialists are marxist but apparently you think you have enough knowledge to identify who and who isn't a marxist which i find disgusting.
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