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 New program for Communist Parties

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oligarch
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PostSubject: New program for Communist Parties   Thu Mar 06, 2008 9:23 am

Many Communist Parties around the world are adopting a new program first adopted by the Communist Party of Brazil after reflecting on the the post WW2 Communist Movement and 20th century socialism.
The old program which largely went against the fundamental principals of Marxism-Leninism went something like this:
1) Two stage revolution in non-independent countries such as Brazil are inevitable.
2) There is a single model for socialism.
3) There is a direct path for the construction of socialism after winning political power.
The new program states that Communist Parties should instead:
1) Participate in parliament at all levels in federal, state and municipal governments with democratic and progressive political forces.
2) Systematically increase connection with organized social movements in urban and rural areas with the poorest layers of the population.
3) Actively and permanently participate in debates about the democratization of media vehicles and enhance its own media.
Do you think the new program or the old program is better? Personally I think the old program had many flaws and that the new program is a good thing as it more closely adheres to Marxism-Leninism and will help Communist Parties grow in political influence.


Last edited by oligarch on Thu Mar 06, 2008 9:26 am; edited 1 time in total
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Renegade_Kautsky
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Thu Mar 06, 2008 9:25 am

Seems more realistic.Wink
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mattabesta
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Thu Mar 06, 2008 2:46 pm

isn't that a program to block pepole from acctuly knowing that the goverment is powere greedy?
I mean If media is state owned then ther is nobody to critizize them.
and isnīt there a need for an opposistion party I mean no communist cuntry has had one of those and them being non communist would be gr8.

then of course you can olso go the democratic way aND ACCTULLY make the pepole chooe wether they want communism or not.
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oligarch
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Fri Mar 07, 2008 3:01 am

mattabesta wrote:
isn't that a program to block pepole from acctuly knowing that the goverment is powere greedy?
I mean If media is state owned then ther is nobody to critizize them.
and isnīt there a need for an opposistion party I mean no communist cuntry has had one of those and them being non communist would be gr8.


Private media is extremely partial.

mattabesta wrote:

then of course you can olso go the democratic way aND ACCTULLY make the pepole chooe wether they want communism or not.

That's the point of the new program.
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Fri Mar 07, 2008 5:35 am

mattabesta wrote:
isn't that a program to block pepole from acctuly knowing that the goverment is powere greedy?
I mean If media is state owned then ther is nobody to critizize them.
and isnīt there a need for an opposistion party I mean no communist cuntry has had one of those and them being non communist would be gr8.

then of course you can olso go the democratic way aND ACCTULLY make the pepole chooe wether they want communism or not.

it will be PUBLIC media not STATE media, it will be like public access.
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mattabesta
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Fri Mar 07, 2008 11:48 am

oligarch wrote:
mattabesta wrote:
isn't that a program to block pepole from acctuly knowing that the goverment is powere greedy?
I mean If media is state owned then ther is nobody to critizize them.
and isnīt there a need for an opposistion party I mean no communist cuntry has had one of those and them being non communist would be gr8.


Private media is extremely partial.

mattabesta wrote:

then of course you can olso go the democratic way aND ACCTULLY make the pepole chooe wether they want communism or not.

That's the point of the new program.
yay if communist always use this programm the'LL NEVER GET ELECTED
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oligarch
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Sat Mar 08, 2008 3:22 am

mattabesta wrote:
]
yay if communist always use this programm the'LL NEVER GET ELECTED

Not true, communist parties have been democratically elected in the past and the new program actually allows for communist parties to have more political influence.
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mattabesta
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Wed Mar 12, 2008 2:06 am

oligarch wrote:
mattabesta wrote:
]
yay if communist always use this programm the'LL NEVER GET ELECTED

Not true, communist parties have been democratically elected in the past and the new program actually allows for communist parties to have more political influence.
well elected what 5 times to 1000 times other parties
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Wed Mar 19, 2008 3:54 pm

The future of the revolutionary forces is the inter-alliance. An only Party cannot achieve the support of the 51% of the population, in most cases.

I think the only way to gain the political power is through something similar to he popular fronts. Great alliances with the different leftists (or revolutionary) parties. This way, also, make not possible the one-thinking and the dogmatism in the work of the revolution.

The social movements have been growing in the last half century, becoming a very strong force, in some places. If you want to rule a society, you need be friendly to (or part of) these movements.
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Wed Mar 19, 2008 6:33 pm

Since I believe modern political systems to be absurd and quite far from democracy, anything that attaches to it or that tolerates it is for me a demonstration of moderation and even of defeat.

I believe Socialism/Communism can be achieved only by the utter destruction of the actual system.
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mattabesta
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Wed Mar 19, 2008 8:23 pm

is evryone here saying that communist parties should first lobby theyer wants and trick the public into voting for them and then killing off opposition but still make it look like democracy?

isn't that kinda facist?
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Wed Mar 19, 2008 9:41 pm

No one has ever said that!
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Zealot_Kommunizma
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Thu Mar 20, 2008 4:17 am

mattabesta wrote:
is evryone here saying that communist parties should first lobby theyer wants and trick the public into voting for them and then killing off opposition but still make it look like democracy?

isn't that kinda facist?

Wow... Spammie is just reflecting the Liberal political agenda on communist parties.

I think Communist parties should prove to people why capitalism is to be blamed for their condition and why this "democratic elections" system simply doesn't work. And on those grounds start organizing workers' councils.
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oligarch
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Thu Mar 20, 2008 4:22 am

Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:
Since I believe modern political systems to be absurd and quite far from democracy, anything that attaches to it or that tolerates it is for me a demonstration of moderation and even of defeat.

I believe Socialism/Communism can be achieved only by the utter destruction of the actual system.

Communist and socialist parties cartainly want to change these systems but participation in such "democratic" governments is the best way to expand political influence.
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Thu Mar 20, 2008 4:27 am

oligarch wrote:


Communist and socialist parties cartainly want to change these systems but participation in such "democratic" governments is the best way to expand political influence.

In my view it has the opposite effect. If we argue these systems are absurd and are not democratic at all and we're able to substanciate it, we don't only keep congruent but we can have a more real and direct political influence.
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oligarch
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Thu Mar 20, 2008 4:30 am

Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:
oligarch wrote:


Communist and socialist parties cartainly want to change these systems but participation in such "democratic" governments is the best way to expand political influence.

In my view it has the opposite effect. If we argue these systems are absurd and are not democratic at all and we're able to substanciate it, we don't only keep congruent but we can have a more real and direct political influence.

Parties in legislatures have much more notoriety and can directly help labor movement.
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Thu Mar 20, 2008 4:31 am

oligarch wrote:


Parties in legislatures have much more notoriety and can directly help labor movement.

In a moderated and contradictory way, yes.

Workers should be risen against this system.
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oligarch
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Thu Mar 20, 2008 4:48 am

Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:
oligarch wrote:


Parties in legislatures have much more notoriety and can directly help labor movement.

In a moderated and contradictory way, yes.

Workers should be risen against this system.

True but the workers have to be conscious before that can happen and the communist movement must support the workers and the labor movement even if they aren't.
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Thu Mar 20, 2008 7:25 am

oligarch wrote:


True but the workers have to be conscious before that can happen and the communist movement must support the workers and the labor movement even if they aren't.

And conscientizing workers doesn't imply accepting and participating in a system we don't agree with. It merely implies to have contact with workers, to be able to get our point to them.
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oligarch
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Thu Mar 20, 2008 8:04 am

Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:
oligarch wrote:


True but the workers have to be conscious before that can happen and the communist movement must support the workers and the labor movement even if they aren't.

And conscientizing workers doesn't imply accepting and participating in a system we don't agree with. It merely implies to have contact with workers, to be able to get our point to them.

Yes, the communist movement should embed itself with the labor movement and by participating in government communist parties can do even more for the worker.
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Thu Mar 20, 2008 8:57 am

oligarch wrote:


Yes, the communist movement should embed itself with the labor movement and by participating in government communist parties can do even more for the worker.

Communist parties should directly join the workers and concientize them instead of joining this absurd system.
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Thu Mar 20, 2008 9:12 am

Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:

Communist parties should directly join the workers and concientize them instead of joining this absurd system.

The latter will lead to the former.
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Thu Mar 20, 2008 11:04 am

oligarch wrote:
Zealot_Kommunizma wrote:

Communist parties should directly join the workers and concientize them instead of joining this absurd system.

The latter will lead to the former.

I think we should never join to a system we want to destroy.
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Thu Mar 20, 2008 2:51 pm

ok I misunderstood.

you want to stage a revolution, right.
plunging the cuntry into civil war.
and winning support of the "poor" wich don't exixt in modren cuntryes.
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Zealot_Kommunizma
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PostSubject: Re: New program for Communist Parties   Thu Mar 20, 2008 9:23 pm

mattabesta wrote:
ok I misunderstood.

you want to stage a revolution, right.
plunging the cuntry into civil war.
and winning support of the "poor" wich don't exixt in modren cuntryes.

Matthías... you really live in a fantasy world. Get real and then argue or just stay in it and don't speak or listen to others.


----

And don't come up with that "1st world paradise" shit. If the "G7 & partners" are rich countries is because they get money from most of the world. If you got a business, money doesn't come from your own business, it comes from your clients.

And even so... please travel to US to see wether there are poor people or not in USA and go out of Iceland to see wether Europe counts with a working class or not.
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