Deportation of Stalin into Gulag

mattabesta wrote:

Riddler wrote:

mattabesta wrote:

Riddler wrote:

BolshevikClock wrote:

But really
He was hardly any better then Hitler

He didn't killed peple because of their nationalities, plus Hitler didn't do anything good for his country.

dose it matter wether you kill pepole becuse of theyer nationalaty
wether you kill a bad person or a good one your still a bad person and stalin kill more pepole than hitler.

Killing 6 000 000 jews was Hitler's order, while some people killed in Russia were killed without Stalin's will or direct order.

At the end of 1930s, Stalin launched the Great Purges, a major campaign of repression against millions of people who were suspected of being a threat to the party were executed or exiled to Gulag labor camps in remote areas of Siberia or Central Asia. A number of ethnic groups in Russia were also forcibly resettled.

Confiscations of grain and other food by the Soviet authorities under his orders contributed to a famine between 1932 and 1934, especially in the key agricultural regions of the Soviet Union, Ukraine (see Holodomor), Kazakhstan and North Caucasus that resulted in millions of deaths. Many peasants resisted collectivization and grain confiscations, but were repressed, most notably well-off peasants deemed "kulaks".^[8]

In the first years of collectivization it was estimated that industrial production would rise by 200% and agricultural production by 50%^[31], but these estimates were not met. Stalin blamed this unanticipated failure on kulaks (rich peasants), who resisted collectivization. (However, kulaks proper made up only 4% of the peasant population; the "kulaks" that Stalin targeted included the slightly better-off peasants who took the brunt of violence from the OGPU and the Komsomol. These peasants were about 60% of the population). Those officially defined as "kulaks," "kulak helpers," and later "ex-kulaks" were to be shot, placed into Gulag labor camps, or deported to remote areas of the country, depending on the charge.

Many historians assert that the disruption caused by collectivization was largely responsible for major famines

According to Alan Bullock, "the total Soviet grain crop was no worse than that of 1931 … it was not a crop failure but the excessive demands of the state, ruthlessly enforced, that cost the lives of as many as five million Ukrainian peasants." Stalin refused to release large grain reserves that could have alleviated the famine, while continuing to export grain; he was convinced that the Ukrainian peasants had hidden grain away, and strictly enforced draconian new collective-farm theft laws in response

Famine affected other parts of the USSR. The death toll from famine in the Soviet Union at this time is estimated at between five and ten million people. The worst crop failure of late tsarist Russia, in 1892, had caused 375,000 to 400,000 deaths.

Although born in Georgia, Stalin became a Russian nationalist and significantly promoted Russian history, language, and Russian national heroes, particularly during the 1930s and 1940s. He held the Russians up as the elder brothers of the non-Russian minorities.

Stalin's role in the fortunes of the Russian Orthodox Church is complex. Continuous persecution in the 1930s resulted in its near-extinction: by 1939, active parishes numbered in the low hundreds (down from 54,000 in 1917), many churches had been leveled, and tens of thousands of priests, monks and nuns were persecuted and killed. Over 100,000 were shot during the purges of 1937–1938.^[51][52] During World War II, the Church was allowed a revival as a patriotic organization, after the NKVD had recruited the new metropolitan, the first after the revolution, as a secret agent. Thousands of parishes were reactivated until a further round of suppression in Khrushchev's time.

Just days before Stalin's death, certain religious sects were outlawed and persecuted.
Many religions popular in the ethnic regions of the Soviet Union including the Roman Catholic Church, Uniats, Baptists, Islam, Buddhism, Judaism, etc. underwent ordeals similar to the Orthodox churches in other parts: thousands of monks were persecuted, and hundreds of churches, synagogues, mosques, temples, sacred monuments, monasteries and other religious buildings were razed.

now do you stil think stalin was a good man?

Every damn thing off of WIKIPEDIA!! There's no way you can take this seriously.

I don't trust Wikipedia either on events either. Why? Becuase I find them constantly changed day by day by various people.

But then, Wiki is run by Americans... =|

Wiki is quite reliable, because its just a collection of sources, just look at the bottom of each page where they are posted

If something on Wikipedia is sourced then its probably true.

Jeiro Sijakeuigwan wrote:

Wiki is run by Americans... =|

That's a bit vague... Run by Capitalists?

kahnsguard wrote:

Jeiro Sijakeuigwan wrote:

Wiki is run by Americans... =|

That's a bit vague... Run by Capitalists?

The funny thing is that capitalists hate much more Stalin, than Trotsky and his crew.

Riddler wrote:

kahnsguard wrote:

Jeiro Sijakeuigwan wrote:

Wiki is run by Americans... =|

That's a bit vague... Run by Capitalists?

The funny thing is that capitalists hate much more Stalin, than Trotsky and his crew.

I'm sure many of them don't know the difference or at least pretend not as they need to pretend that Stalin was a communist to have a valid basis for their anti-communism.

oligarch wrote:

I'm sure many of them don't know the difference or at least pretend not as they need to pretend that Stalion was a communist to have a valid basis for their anti-communism.

Thank you very much oligarch! That's exactly my sentiments.

Quote :

You speak as if the affirmations that Stalin killed 20+ million people were as well documented and supported by as strong evidence as the Holocaust is. The magnitud of Stalin's executions are claimed to be tens of times larger than the Holocaust, yet, there's much less evidence on them even taking into account the great ammount of people that would be implied or know about those executions.

It’s also worth pointing out that archival evidence suggests lower figures, in fact according to an article I read a while back (its was by Wheatcroft I think) these figures are very reliable since the NKVD etc. would not do anything, or kill anyone without permission.

Quote :

That claim states that nearly 33 million families were exterminated by Stalin and yet people were unaware of or agreed with that. The chances are that these 33 million families, these 100 million people "researchers" claim Stalin killed, had links with at least 80 or 90% of Soviet population making impossible such large executions to be as weakly evidenced as they are.

I believe executions are placed at 1.5 million tops, with the most precise figures being in the 7-800,000 range. There is, as Alexander Dallin says, no evidence to support the claim that the 32-33 famine was deliberate. It is also interesting to note another recent read of mine by Mark Tauger, specifically referring to the chapter on the famine in the “Black Book of Communism”, amazingly they take sources which show the Soviet leaders took measures to alleviate the famine and conclude that it was deliberately inflicted.

Hopefully I don’t come across as a Tankie here cause I Gulag’d that guys arse. We should be opposing Stalin based on what he did do, rather than exaggerations designed to make denouncing him easier (cause otherwise you’ll get your ass handed to you by a real Stalinist).

Jeiro Sijakeuigwan wrote:

I don't trust Wikipedia either on events either. Why? Becuase I find them constantly changed day by day by various people.

But then, Wiki is run by Americans... =|

try writing shit on wiki and see how long it takes to be deleted, my record is 37 seconds.

mattabesta wrote:

try writing shit on wiki and see how long it takes to be deleted, my record is 37 seconds.

My friend's and I's are TEN seconds.

Jeiro Sijakeuigwan wrote:

mattabesta wrote:

try writing shit on wiki and see how long it takes to be deleted, my record is 37 seconds.

My friend's and I's are TEN seconds.

wow you are some noobs try writing it in a langvic wic has less than 10,000 articels it'll stay for longer.

The majority has said gulag; when will he be moved there?

Pannekoek wrote:

The majority has said gulag; when will he be moved there?

when jesus gets up to jugdjing evryone.

mattabesta wrote:

when jesus gets up to jugdjing evryone.

Doesn't he already do that?

I said undecided, because there wasn't a "who cares" choice on the ballot. He was no better and no worse than any other leaders of the past, all things considered.

Quote :

Doesn't he already do that?

Hopefully sarcasm. FSM knows we don't need another bible-thumper on this forum.

kick him in the nuts and let him go free
sound good?

Pannekoek wrote:

Hopefully sarcasm. FSM knows we don't need another bible-thumper on this forum.

No, not sarcasm. And i don't see how that means i thump bibles. I'm just saying Jesus judges people. That's a bad thing, if that's what you were misunderstanding.

And i think the views i've expressed in my short time here have proven that my beliefs are anything but religious (if not only for the fact that i denounce so called "morals")

Anyone who likes fucking STALIN is either off their rocker or blissfully unaware of how much of a butcher he was. He killed more jews than hitler.

nillerz wrote:

Anyone who likes fucking STALIN is either off their rocker or blissfully unaware of how much of a butcher he was. He killed more jews than hitler.

You wanna back that assertion with a source? otherwise i can only assume that you're off your rocker.

NoJustice.NoPeace wrote:

mattabesta wrote:

when jesus gets up to jugdjing evryone.

Doesn't he already do that?

I said undecided, because there wasn't a "who cares" choice on the ballot. He was no better and no worse than any other leaders of the past, all things considered.

lol yeah he just killed his oqn pepole we don't care.

Many rulers kill their own people.

Pannekoek wrote:

Many rulers kill their own people.

does that make it right

Comrade Pollett wrote:

kick him in the nuts and let him go free
sound good?

That's gay.

Riddler wrote:

That's gay.

how is that gay ?